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  • So my primary complaint with this wiki is that we have data duplicated across the site for the same units. This is primarilly due to how wikis work.

    I have put together a POC that could solve this issue... I have created a database of sorts that lets you request information about any unit based on its id.

    Examples:

    • {{UnitInfo|10011|name}} =
    • {{UnitInfo|Fencer Vargas|element}} = Fire
    • etc...

    Basically, we could store all the information for all the units in one big table, and every page that needs the unit details would request it using the UnitInfo template.

    For performance and supportability, we may want to split up the data into subtables based on element or something (e.g. 1xxxx, 2xxxx, 3xxxx), but that could be done seamlessly at some future point if we don't decide to do it now.

    What do you think?

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    • I have no clue what that means.

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    • Basically what I'm saying is that we would have one place to request the data for our units. Right now, each page has it's own data for each unit (e.g. Fencer Vargas data is on the Unit Evolution List:Fire Units, Fencer Vargas, No.0001~0040, etc...) If we need to update something, we have to go to multiple pages to make the update consistent across the site. What I have created is a centralized place to request the data for each unit. If we need to update something, we would update the data in that central location. All the pages that present data for Fencer Vargas would be pointing to that cental data store, so they would all be updated automatically. No need to go to every page to try and keep things in sync, because everything pulls its data from that one location.

      If you look at my first comment, you can see how I am calling the UnitInfo template with a <unit id>, and a <property name>. That template is returning the property value for the unit associated with that id.

      For example: The unit template could be updated to only require the unit id. All the other properties that are needed to render the page would be pulled from the UnitInfo template by passing it the <unit id> and the <property name>.

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    • While I know that you're trying to reduce replication of data in multiple places (which can lead to inconsistencies when not all are changed) and make it "easier" by keeping all the info centralized in a "database" of sorts, I think it'll be hard to get others to buy in to this idea because it IS a wiki, and meant to be easy for anyone to update.

      Using this "database" like model requires contributors to know this 5-digit game ID assigned to each unit.  In anything, the key/id should be something identifiable in-game by players, which is either the name (which is prone to mistyping/mispellings), or the "Unit No".

      While your idea is great for easier data access and housekeeping, adapting this model will definitely alienate the community and it'll be up to a small handful of contributors to keep things up-to-date and adhere to this.

      Lastly, creating this "database" of 300+ units in text, which is the only way to do this in my mind, will be a nightmare to look through and update - you never know when the game will decide to change wording (which it has for leader skills and brave bursts) or descriptions.

      I aplaud your idea and thinking, but I think it'll create more work in the long run, if not for you, but for the normal contributor.

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    • Oh, something similar was already in place before I signed on:  Template:UnitName

      It originally only had entries for Eze, but I used it for evolution mats (and Memetes, for testing the redesign of the unit layout).  This just harkons back to your sub-table idea :P

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    • yeah, that's the basic idea... we could split out the the data so it's not all in one template, but we should have only one template to call when requesting the data. UnitInfo

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    • That was me typing above... hadn't logged in yet :P

      Still, that's a lot of groundwork to cover to get this set up, AND get contributors to understand and use. Otherwise you're gonna find yourself updating the ENTIRE wiki :P

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    • I agree with luxionmk2. At this rate with the admin not turning up to lockdown the entire wiki, any monkey can just come in and ruin. Because that's alot of data to port over.

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    • Well, I'll see if I can come up with a simple solution that makes it easy for people to understand/update, but that is certainly a valid concern...

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    • So I have updated my approach to hopefully address the issues you guys pointed out...

      I have update the Fencer Vargas detail page. (see the first 2 lines in the source) everything else on that page is the same.

      Then check out the UnitInfo template. You can see how I'm using the detail page as my data source to get data from it.

      To make this work

      • All the detail pages would need to have that minor (2 line) change made to them
      • Other, non-detail pages, could be updated to use the UnitInfo template as they are touched

      In the end, we would have only 1 page for each unit that would contain its data (the detail page), and all other pages would use the UnitInfo template to retreive the unit data.

      Thoughts?

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    • Simple and easy and nice. I like it. 

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    • It saves the trouble of opening up the template and then do another edit which defeats the purpose. The edit screen is also very small and hard to read at times even though i'm using a 1440P monitor. Kudos. I like that new template you created.

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    • Haha, that's pretty cool! You're using the unit pages as your source, genius. However, this disables the Visual Editor, which I've learned many users use to edit these pages. Personally, I never use the Visual Editor and it was a pain to fix the template to support the visual editor. FORCING users to use the "source editor" is a better in my opinion :)

      Kynaareth, you're probably referring to the visual editor that pops up in that tiny box. What you're seeing now with Fencer Vargas is the "source editor".

      Benwhite, we still have the concern of users not knowing how to use UnitInfo, or misspelling the name of units since that becomes a dependency now. However, those are minor concerns and the more experienced and regular contributors can go and fix those - I'm assuming the basic contributor will still be "hard-coding" values instead of referencing the data source, via UnitInfo.

      We can go about updating unit pages to support your changes since it:

      • won't break existing unit pages
      • still allows contributors to update unit pages
      • disables visual editing, which caused more problems for me laying the groundwork anyways
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    • sounds great... I am using more templates for things like the Unit Evo List, so once we get things converted UnitInfo will be built into the template, and the issues of hard coding values will evaporate.

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    • Just as an FYI, we could bake code into the Unit template so the visual editor will still work. I opted not to do this initially because the Unit template is allready overwhelming. If you feel this is really important, let me know, but I wanted to keep these two peices seperate for sanity reasons.

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    • Well my point is the source editor is better and also simple for contributors. I mean its kinda straight forward.

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    • And by using UnitInfo the page will be able to just extract information from the specific ID which is even easier to maintain data across the entire wikia

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    • I agree, I just wanted to present all options on the table... I'll try to update as many as I can today. I'm starting with 0001-0040, Feel free to grab a block if you want to help.

      0001-0320 complete... moving on to testing the data integrity, whee...

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    • I just created a new template Template:Unit_Dir which is designed to take a <unit id> and output a row for the directory pages. This template is utilizing the new UnitInfo functionality.

      I updated the directory page No.0281~0320 as a first test case.

      Let me know what you think.

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    • dude

      You are just simply awesome...

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    • I'm struggling with an issue... Basically, some units are acting different than others, and I don't know why.

      Example:

      code output
      [[{{:Fencer Vargas|evointo-link}}]] [[]]
      [[{{:Drake Chief Aisha|evointo-link}}]] [[]]

      Any idea what's going on here?

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    • I figured it out... pages with categories directly applied to them don't function as expected, I removed the Six Heros category from "Fencer Vargas" and it started working as expected

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    • Any thoughts on what is the best solution to address the units that have categories applied directly to the page?

      It seems that Six Heroes and Evolution Units has been applied to a fair number of units.

      Can we drop these or dynamically apply these categories to the proper units somehow?

      Also, I have created a sample of what the Evo List would look like when it's migrated over... User:Benwhite/sandbox:template you can see the impact the categories have on the units, and also how inconsistent our data was.

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    • For evolution unit i can assist you in removing them as i was the one that created the category.


      EDIT: removed all

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    • Thanks, I'm updating the unit template to support some of the new features we have and might add in some improved auto-categorization stuff too. The code applied categories don't affect things negatively.

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    • I noticed the change recently, looks pretty cool. It's too bad we can't change the other Unit No. pages with it, though. - Zero

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    • ben just do whatever is necessary as i'm not familiar with how the code works in wikia as compared to html coding (though i see similairities) due to wikia being super friendly user which is a big no no to me. Lol.

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    • KodachiZero wrote:
      I noticed the change recently, looks pretty cool. It's too bad we can't change the other Unit No. pages with it, though. - Zero

      We can probably get someone to change the locked pages...

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    • Benwhite wrote:
      KodachiZero wrote:
      I noticed the change recently, looks pretty cool. It's too bad we can't change the other Unit No. pages with it, though. - Zero
      We can probably get someone to change the locked pages...

      Hopefully, it's still odd how the pages were locked because of "vandalism" even though there was no vandalism on them whatsoever. -Kodachi

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    • 184.73.72.163
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